Dangers of high tracking force?

V

veloxsol

New Member
Hey guys,

I've got a JVC JL-B44 with a stanton 680ee that I'm trying to set up with the correct force and anti-skate. I read on the forums that this cartridge has a force of 1.5g. But when I set it to 1.5g (after I calibrated the weight) it sounded like crap! I kept going up until I got a sound I liked which happened was all the way up at 2.5g! (actually it's 2.3g after i backed it down til I heard a difference, then back up to a good spot etc) I like the full sound I'm getting, but I'm worried I'm damaging my records now especially since the touchdown sounds harsh (almost like it's too heavy...)

It needs a new stylus which I haven't purchased yet (I was too excited to wait for it to set up my TT). Could a worn stylus cause this discrepancy in force?

-Vel
 
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Yes, a worn stylus is bad and you can't go by the sound if it is.

Also, do you have the brush on the stylus? If so, you need to set the tracking force one gram above what the specs call for. Thus, to have the stylus tracking at 1.5 grams, you would need to set the weight to 2.5.

Doug
 
The brush on Stanton cartridges sweeps dust out of the groove in advance of the stylus, of course, and provides some degree of stability when playing warped records.

That's the theory anyway and there has always been disagreement since the day Stanton started putting them on their cartridges.

I leave the brush on my stereo cartridges but I found that, on my Pickering XUV-4500Q quad cartridge, the brush affected the tracking in the inner groove area and so I removed it.

Doug
 
The brush is to dust the surface of the record in the grooves ahead of what is playing (notice that it covers several grooves ahead). Doug is exactly right in that the upward pressure of the brush on the record lightens the tracking force by 1 gram. When you put the stylus on the scale, the brush is floating in the air and you can't get an accurate measurement with the brush, hence why the mfgr recommends the 1 gram addition in force. 2.5 grams is your correct weight with that cart, but it is only applying 1.5 on the record surface. I look at the specs as a guide and not a rule. Each cart is different, and each has a sweet spot for VTF (and VTA), and no two carts are alike. Foe example, my Grado Gold is recommended at 1.5 grams, but it tends to get distortion in the highs at 1.5...but at 1.8, it's perfect.

As Doug said, a worn stylus though is the worst thing you can do for your records. Examine the stylus with a magnifying glass or jewelers loupe. You should be able to at least see that the tip is pointy, and not rounded, nor have any chips out of the surface. If it's not close to perfect, stop using it immediately! If you have a Mr. Clean magic eraser (the kind you use for house hold cleaning), you can dip the stylus in that a few times (dip, not rub) and that should take enough funk off the tip to see the condition.

Good luck, and enjoy...the 680 is a lovely cart.

James R.
 
Thanks guys, this is great. Yeah the stylus actually looks pretty okay on inspection, but I don't trust my inspection skills for these kinds of things. So a new stylus is on the way. ..I just hate waiting :boring:
 
With the brush down, and in contact with the LP, it's taking some(with an upward force) of the weight off the stylus. So adding a gram will counteract the upward force of the brush.

According to stanton the tracking range is .75 to 1.5gr. So what you are reading in the forum is the MAXIMUM recommended VTA with a NEW STYLUS and the brush UP. With the brush down add approx. 1gr.

Larry
 
Overall, I've liked Stanton's brush more than Shure's; it's ungrounded, so debris seems to stick to it better, and static charges are drained off well with the grounded stylus assembly (for example, the felt record mat clings to my records when using Shure's brush, but not when using a Stanton brush). Both help tame arm resonance and record warp issues (I find the Shure better at this).

Tracking force with the brush can be confusing. I find it easiest to remember that the brush weighs 1 gram and is self-supporting during play. If you zero-balance your arm with the brush installed and suspended in the air when balancing, you need to set 2.5 grams of tracking force for 1.5 grams effective downforce at the stylus, one gram of which accounts for the self-supporting brush (or, put another way, the cartridge is effectively 1 gram lighter than you balanced for once the brush supports itself on the record surface); if you zero-balance the arm with the brush removed, you can attach the brush later and not make any changes to the tracking force setting as the brush simply supports itself (you might want to up anti-skating a bit, though, as the brush contributes to skating forces).
 
I just take my brush off my 681EEE. It was yanking my cartridge, scratching the needle across several grooves in the first track. I was unaware that I should add approx 1 gram but I don't know if that was the cause. My record player is not a fancy one but decent. I just used the record cleaner before I play and just lower the dust cover.
 
I assume if you clean the record well enough and keep the lid down, the brush doesn't have much to brush out of the way. I did notice though that on a record with slight visible warping, I didn't hear it at all. I'll go ahead and assume it was the brush and keep it on.
 
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