Empire 698 magnetic cueing problem advice, help?

MrMonster

Totally Lost In The 70's
Hello Lads,
I picked up another Empire turntable, like I need another.
This is the 698 with the lightweight tonearm and push button cueing;

Everything on this table is just sweet as new, but the cueing works too well push the down button and the arm drops like a stone, push the up, and the arm goes near vertical. It cues, but no damping. On dis assembly of the cue mechanism, I am surprised.
Basically it's a doorbell.
The cue works on a magnetic solenoid, but only on the down stroke. the up position is the normal position with no current to the arm. the up is supplied by a flat spring on the bottom of the solenoid piston, and the down is the magnet being pushed down.

I have two 698's and on checking the working arm, I found no difference except the piston on the working arm has a tack coating applied to the piston and to the inside of the coil. This is what dampens the down stroke and slows the upstroke of the piston to raise and lower the arm

This coating isn't a grease, or wax as it on the piston pretty good and does not wipe away easily, but I don't want to rub too hard, as then I will two arms not working.
IT is very apparent that the non working arm has had someone playing with it as there are two different screws. I think the last person had a stuck piston from age, so wiped off the coating in an attempt to repair

Pictures are below, you see the two pistons, and the coating is very apparent and is evenly applied around the piston.

I have gone over and over the schematic and can see nothing that would control current to the coil of the solenoid, and the working tonearm works flawlessly on both tables.

Anyone know what this coating is? I have tried a number of tacky lubes waxes and other things to no avail, and the grease only sped up the cue.
It isn;t something that just wipes off, and takes a bit of effort to remove and install the piston. On the working arm, the cue is slow and gentle like my SME 3009.

If you have any idea of what this coating is, or a substitute, I would be in your debt.

The fist photos shows the coil in the arm, the flat spring, the piston and the arm rest of the cue.

Thank,
Donald Bowman
 

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May be the coating is silicone oil.:scratch2:

If it is, you would need to determine which grade you would need.

The commonly used ones in some Japanese turntables are the:

300,000wt
http://www.amainhobbies.com/product...osho-Silicone-Differential-Oil-300000wt--40cc

500,000wt
http://www.amainhobbies.com/product...osho-Silicone-Differential-Oil-500000wt--40cc

They are also sometimes blended together to creat an in between 400,000wt (ish) end product.

There are lighter weight silicone oil available.

Hope this is what you need!:music:
 
Empire cue

May be the coating is silicone oil.:scratch2:

If it is, you would need to determine which grade you would need.

The commonly used ones in some Japanese turntables are the:

300,000wt
http://www.amainhobbies.com/product...osho-Silicone-Differential-Oil-300000wt--40cc

500,000wt
http://www.amainhobbies.com/product...osho-Silicone-Differential-Oil-500000wt--40cc

They are also sometimes blended together to creat an in between 400,000wt (ish) end product.

There are lighter weight silicone oil available.

Hope this is what you need!:music:

This thought crossed my mind, but will the thick Silicone dry to a tacky state? as there is no way to fill it with silicone oil, as the bottom plate does not seal.
Thanks,
 
It won't dry to a tacky state, it's already very tacky. All you do is coat the piston and the cylinder and reassemble. It won't dry and it won't leak out. I also tried all kinds of substitutes like plumbers silicone grease and caliper grease (on a Dual, not an Empire), they're too slippery.

I'd try the 500,000cs weight on that table since the cueing is solenoid operated.

The link above is a good source or you may try a local hobby shop.

Edit: As Balifly said, it's silicone oil, not grease.
 
Last edited:
Cueing fixed, Works Perfect

Hello Lads,
Thanks for the Silicone tip. I bought the 600,000 diff oil, and all it needed was less than a dab to do the trick. Too bad I am out $14.00 to use only a 1/100th of a gram.
Still better than sending the arm out to someone to repair. But the oil is here for any future problems.

Arm now cues to perfection with a gentle down stroke, with no stress on the stylus and an easy consistent lift on the up.
I can actually watch a gentle bend and flex of the stylus as the cue is operated

Thanks again,
Donald bowman
 
Last edited:
Hi all, I was also having a cuing problem with my 698. It dropped like a rock and would not come up unless pulled. Then the weight of the arm would slowly push it back down. I thought the worse and took the cue pot apart. When removing the bottom plate the little metal leaf spring fell out in two pieces. Using a little imagination and figuring what do I have to lose I picked up a piece of .020 piano wire from my local hardware. I bent the wire so the screw would go through the loop when putting it back together. I cut and bent the wire to reach the center of the plunger and reassembled the mechanism. After putting the arm back on the table and plugging everything back in I was ecstatic that the electronic cue again worked like new. The arm raises and lowers as it did when I bought the table in 1977. Makes me a happy camper!
 
My empire 698 arm does not go up anymore also. I took it to my local shop but they gave up and just told me to use it as a manual turntable and that’s what I’ve been doing for the last two years someday maybe I’ll try fixing It.
 
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