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Cartridge recommendations for Thorens TP-16 arm please!

Grady Cain

Grady Cain

Batterista
Subscriber
Anyone have a recommendation for an MM cart to use with the very low mass TP-16 II Thorens tonearm with TP-63 headshell? I am finding it difficult to find an appropriate high-compliance cart for this very light weight arm. Any input is welcome. Thank you...
 
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Thank you although I should have prefaced my inquiry with some information. I am well-versed in matching carts with tone-arms and have a very good working knowledge of resonant frequency. I guess what I am looking for here are members' personal experiences with their own match-ups. Which specific brand and model cart did you use with your TP-16 arm? Compliance specs are not always available from each cartridge manufacturer so I'm hoping some out there have their own trials and errors or successes to share. Not sure if maybe this should be in either the "turntable" or "Thorens owners" section. Thanks again...
 
Cartridge recommendations need a budget. There are carts from $11-5000 that will work just fine. Where do you want to be?

My 8-gram effective mass arm has Dynavectors and Ortofon LOMCs bolted to headshells.
 
Blue Shadow said:
Cartridge recommendations need a budget. There are carts from $11-5000 that will work just fine. Where do you want to be?

My 8-gram effective mass arm has Dynavectors and Ortofon LOMCs bolted to headshells.
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Do you have a $5,000 cart on your Thorens? Like I stated, I am looking for personal experiences so if you do, please tell me all about it! I also mentioned I'm interested in a MM cart so the Dynavector and the Ortofon you referenced would be out. Thanks for your reply!

newzealand said:
id give a stanton 681 or 881s a go
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I've been considering the Stanton 881S quite honestly. Being a high-compliance cart, I know on paper it will work with my low-mass Thorens tone arm. Have you had personal experience with this cart on a Thorens? If so, I am curious as to what you like about it. Thanks for your reply!

Grenadeslio said:
A Pickering XV15 1200E/D1200 is my favorite cartridge/stylus on my Thorens.
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I would be curious to know if you are running it on the same TP-16 tonearm and why you like it. I can't find any compliance specs on this cart, even in the Pickering XV-15 owners manual. Thanks for your reply!
 
Grady Cain said:
Do you have a $5,000 cart on your Thorens? Like I stated, I am looking for personal experiences so if you do, please tell me all about it! I also mentioned I'm interested in a MM cart so the Dynavector and the Ortofon you referenced would be out. Thanks for your reply!



I've been considering the Stanton 881S quite honestly. Being a high-compliance cart, I know on paper it will work with my low-mass Thorens tone arm. Have you had personal experience with this cart on a Thorens? If so, I am curious as to what you like about it. Thanks for your reply!



I would be curious to know if you are running it on the same TP-16 tonearm and why you like it. I can't find any compliance specs on this cart, even in the Pickering XV-15 owners manual. Thanks for your reply!
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Actually it's on the TP11 arm but close enough for government work. Obviously I haven't tried every available cartridge that will work with the Thorens, but I do have a few, including a couple Grace, Audio Technica, Grado, other Pickerings, etc, but the 1200 is my preference.

Very well balanced cartridge with good bass, but my experience is only with original stylus, after market might not be equivalent.

Here's the thing, it's not by any means my favorite mm cartridge, it just happens to have a synergy with the Thorens the others don't. That said it just didn't gel with my Grace arm on several records, really surprised me as on paper it should have been a perfect match.

one of the things I like about spinning vinyl, so much fun experimenting
 
Grenadeslio said:
Actually it's on the TP11 arm but close enough for government work. Obviously I haven't tried every available cartridge that will work with the Thorens, but I do have a few, including a couple Grace, Audio Technica, Grado, other Pickerings, etc, but the 1200 is my preference.

Very well balanced cartridge with good bass, but my experience is only with original stylus, after market might not be equivalent.

Here's the thing, it's not by any means my favorite mm cartridge, it just happens to have a synergy with the Thorens the others don't. That said it just didn't gel with my Grace arm on several records, really surprised me as on paper it should have been a perfect match.

one of the things I like about spinning vinyl, so much fun experimenting
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Man that is exactly the kind of response I'm looking for! I get it about the"synergy" - It's no different than getting that right tube combination that just feels (and of course, sounds) right. Of my 3 Thorens 'tables, 2 have the light-weight TP-16 arms. I have a Shelter 201 on my TD145 Mk.II which actually works well. I am looking for a better option for my TD147 Jubilee, also with the TP16. I will give the XV15 a look.

The experimentation is indeed a huge part of this experience for me as well. I am more involved in experimenting with tubes in my collection of vintage amps but am not as savvy with cartridges. That is why I created this thread - to hear of others' experiments.

Thank you so much for your reply and insight...
 
I'm running a Audio-Technica VM540ML Dual Moving Magnet Cartridge on my Thorens 126 MKIII.
Its a great match and very detailed. I hate the Thorens However. :(
 
reardonp6 said:
I'm running a Audio-Technica VM540ML Dual Moving Magnet Cartridge on my Thorens 126 MKIII.
Its a great match and very detailed. I hate the Thorens However. :(
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Interesting you find that cart to work with that tonearm on your TD126. I have an Audio-Technica VM750SH Dual MM on my TD147. The compliance specs are the same between the 2 (very low) and it sounds like absolute crap on my table. The RF calculation ends up being above what is considered tolerable and I definitely notice a good deal of low end distortion because of it. The reason I started this thread actually is because I can't stand that cart on that tonearm. That is also what prompted me to start learning about tonearm/cart matching. Had I researched it first, I could have saved the $400 on that cart and got something else. Anyone want to buy an Audio-Technica VM750SH? lol

Thank you for your reply!
 
Grady Cain said:
The compliance specs are the same between the 2 (very low) and it sounds like absolute crap on my table. The RF calculation ends up being above what is considered tolerable and I definitely notice a good deal of low end distortion because of it.
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The compliance at 100Hz is not the standard, just the Japanese standard. The proper compliance for the RF calculator is about 1.8 times the 100Hz compliance, making these AT good matches for the arm. Sound quality to be determined as will all cartridges.

I have not seen actual resonance determinations using records with these new ATs in the Thornes arm but the multiplier, anywhere from 1.5-2.0 for a 100Hz compliance is well known.
 
Do you insist on an MM or just something that will work with an MM input? As to the 740, post it up in BT and offer swaps, someone will probably bite. Might bring something nice to try.
 
Blue Shadow said:
The compliance at 100Hz is not the standard, just the Japanese standard. The proper compliance for the RF calculator is about 1.8 times the 100Hz compliance, making these AT good matches for the arm. Sound quality to be determined as will all cartridges.

I have not seen actual resonance determinations using records with these new ATs in the Thornes arm but the multiplier, anywhere from 1.5-2.0 for a 100Hz compliance is well known.
Click to expand...

Well numbers are numbers but my ears don't lie. Way too much low frequency distortion with the AT cart as compared to the Shelter or my Shure M97xe. Really appreciate your input - thank you!
 
Yes, that is the correct way to do it, listen. Not that the sound is a result of a mismatch in compliance/effective mass, don't know, but if you don't care for it, it needs to move off the table to the drawer and on to someone else I guess, eventually.
 
Blue Shadow said:
Do you insist on an MM or just something that will work with an MM input? As to the 740, post it up in BT and offer swaps, someone will probably bite. Might bring something nice to try.
Click to expand...

MM carts work better for the music I listen to with the set-ups I'm referencing. I have an MC cart on my modern 2 channel system in a different room.
I am absolutely going to get that AT cart on BT. Just waiting to see if one of my audio club members is interested in it first.
Thank you so much for your input!
 
Blue Shadow said:
Yes, that is the correct way to do it, listen. Not that the sound is a result of a mismatch in compliance/effective mass, don't know, but if you don't care for it, it needs to move off the table to the drawer and on to someone else I guess, eventually.
Click to expand...

Well said my friend!
 
The XV 15 with either JICO or LPGear styli is the safest bet.
ADC QLM/XLM "III" is an excellent choice if you can find the proper stylus, that's the trick.

Audio Technica line contacts are an excellent choice, too.

Shure V15s, Ortofon OMs and Grados...not so much.
 
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