Pioneer HPM-100: Best speaker ever made?

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SoCal Sam said:
The OP forgot to lead with "IMHO".
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Yeah I didn't mean to come off as an a**hole, it's a very humble opinion and I wanted to come off as aggressive so people would be very direct and not hold anything back. I want to see people tear them apart to make me second guess everything about them.
 
Only thing to make you second guess them is to try and make the next AK fest.. or one in your area.. then you'll get to hear some exotics (and not so exotics) that you could never imagine are out there..
 
I know I though a pair of KLH 6 were the best speakers ever at one time. I still think they're pretty good, but after learning a lot here, and getting out and listening to, and buying, many many more speakers, they probably don't even land in the top 20% of what I like. At the end of the day, you still might like your HPMs, but you'll have a much better feel for why you like them once you hear more speakers than, say, the Bose 901s you mentioned (also a topic of some heated, closed threads).
 
SoCal Sam said:
We are having fun, right?

There is no surface treatment on the upper driver cones so dampening is very poor. IMO and IIRC, there is some amplification of frequencies above 3 mHz that is caused by the resonance of the material. See the response curve.

The mids on the HPM-100 are the weakest part. I used to crank up the mid control and turn down the high control just to get the balance near neutral.

A port is an easy way to augment bass but it is also a sound source that lags the primary source causing phase error. Ported designs can sound good but will never be as accurate as sealed cabinets.

I've had the 015 ribbon hooked up to a HPM x-over, by itself. That is the only way I can hear the output and it isn't very much. To my ears, maybe a squeak but that's it.

I always thought Pioneer was close with the HPM-100. The woofer is very nice and the cabinets are well built and look very nice when the walnut veneer is in top condition. I would have changed the cone mid and tweeter for domes and re-tuned to bring forward the mids.

I prefer vertical alignment, either symmetric or mirrored. To my ears, most of the voicing occurs with the mids and tweeters and I find that imaging is much better with vertical alignment.

BTW, I owned four pairs at one time. I also owned 3 pairs of HPM-60's and 2 pairs of HPM-40's. All gone now.
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I always thought that it would be hard to rely on a response curve because the human ear does not respond to all frequencies equally, so in actuality it seems to me that a flat frequency response (on paper) would not necessarily be a good thing. However, I definitely do agree that the tweeters are harsh, but all you gotta do is EQ them. However, upon looking at the graph it does appear relatively flat, including thru the mids. But when it gets to the tweeter range, it spikes up, which would explain why IMO the highs are harsh. I feel that boosting the mids would overpower the bass in these things.

I always felt the bass was very present, especially on vinyl, it sounds very full to me where most speakers sound dull and muddy. As far as the super tweeter goes, did you check the output level of it with a meter and compare to the other drivers? I've never done this before becuase I could always hear them (and the misery I've felt when I hear them cut out :)
)
 
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stereofanboy said:
:DHPM-100s are the best speakers ever made.
HPM 100s sound subpar unless they're mated with an SX receiver.
Even with SX receivers the tweeters can be a bit harsh and the 125 hz range bass can be harsh as well.

You're changing your mind as fast as my girl, and that's fast.
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Not exactly, I think you were misinterpreting me. I do feel they sound subpar unless they're getting a clean signal the SX receivers can provide, which would be true of ANY speaker. That cheap Sony receiver from Best Buy just wasn't doing them justice. That thing put out way too much distortion, and its noticeable.
 
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similost said:
Only thing to make you second guess them is to try and make the next AK fest.. or one in your area.. then you'll get to hear some exotics (and not so exotics) that you could never imagine are out there..
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Where can I find out more information about these AK fests?
 
To each his own. I bet they sound nice, I never had the chance to get a pair and more than likely never will. I am also a "low budget" AK'er, and am thankfull for the quality info, nice members and laughs I have had.

I just found this, and would love to hear some in person: :yes:

http://www.higherfi.com/spkrlist/speakerlist.htm
 
I have sold three pair of HPM 100s, and two pair of L100s. As far as the Pioneers go, once you leave the linear response and start into the driver thermal compression, the only thing really getting louder is the distortion, so loud is not a good thing at that point.

As others have pointed out, there are indeed many speakers which have similar strong points, and do them better. :yes:
 
man ; talk about panties getting knotted ;) to each his own. I've heard them and they didnt sound bad at all ..... heard better, heard worse ..... but "best Ive ever heard" ...them's fightin words
 
In my best Hank Hill voice, "son I reckon we caught us some big lunkers out here trollin' today, I tell you what, heh, heh..."

Seriously though I suggest you go find a way to hear some of the speakers on this list before you go making bold and ill informed conjectures:

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=61002


For example the idea that HPM-100s sound better than flatter frequency response with more sophisticated crossover and better drivers JBL 4430, or L300s or Everests, or Kilpschorns, or KEF 107.2s or B & W 802s, or big Tannoys is laughable.

Edited to correct link.
 
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barkerd said:
man ; talk about panties getting knotted ;) to each his own. I've heard them and they didnt sound bad at all ..... heard better, heard worse ..... but "best Ive ever heard" ...them's fightin words
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I know my personal animosity towards them was because I felt kind of duped by all the praise they got after I actually acquired a pair. They were built up to be this amazing speaker and they did not even stand up to some very average speakers I already owned. If they hadn't been built up to be world class, I wouldn't think twice about them.

To be fair..this has happened to me a number of times in this hobby with different gear that, at least in my opinion, didn't live up to the hype.
 
acdc7369 said:
Yeah I didn't mean to come off as an a**hole, it's a very humble opinion and I wanted to come off as aggressive so people would be very direct and not hold anything back. I want to see people tear them apart to make me second guess everything about them.
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Fair enough.

acdc7369 said:
I always thought that it would be hard to rely on a response curve because the human ear does not respond to all frequencies equally, so in actuality it seems to me that a flat frequency response (on paper) would not necessarily be a good thing. However, I definitely do agree that the tweeters are harsh, but all you gotta do is EQ them. However, upon looking at the graph it does appear relatively flat, including thru the mids. But when it gets to the tweeter range, it spikes up, which would explain why IMO the highs are harsh. I feel that boosting the mids would overpower the bass in these things.

I always felt the bass was very present, especially on vinyl, it sounds very full to me where most speakers sound dull and muddy. As far as the super tweeter goes, did you check the output level of it with a meter and compare to the other drivers? I've never done this before becuase I could always hear them (and the misery I've felt when I hear them cut out :)
)
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True, looking at response curves sometimes does not correspond to home results and test data is open to manipulation for (gulp) marketing purposes. However, I still believe there is a strong correlation between test results and sound quality. This takes a leap of faith from the objective to the subjective and here is where your personal preference takes over.

Others have gotten good results with EQ's but IMO, any speaker that needs compensation is imbalanced to begin with. I am a short signal path adherent so anything that gets in the way is no good.

Bass has never been a complaint for me. The woofers are well controlled, even at insane levels. However, the port does loosen up the attack so sharpness is not great.

The super tweeters are ribbons and will test open with a meter. I can't hear them when installed and playing with the rest of the drivers.
 
Years ago I had some Mach 1's and Mach 2's, all 4 hooked up to my Denon PMA-920, and it sounded pretty good. I ran across a pair of HPM 100's for $100 bucks and I jumped. These are some pretty cool looking speakers, but after trying them out, I sold them to my buddy for $100. The Mach 1's and 2's sounded better to me, with the Mach 2's sounding the best. Them HPM's sure are some lookers though.
 
Pioneer is the best company! And all of that speakers are quality
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Sorry, All in good humor here, You had a slight misspelled word.

Pioneer is the best company! And all that we speak of is quality
 
HPM900 pwns HPM100. :D

(they really do sound better, IMHO... better bass tuning, among other things)...

Regards,
Gordon.
 
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