A nice vintage preamp?

I'm thinking about bi-amping my set-up and I'm wondering about what would be a good preamp for this. Ideally, I'd need 2 sets of outputs, defeatable tone controls (or none at all), 2 phono inputs with one for moving coil, selectable impedance on the phono inputs (ok, that's a stretch). Tube-based preamps would most certainly be out of my financial reach, but I'd like it to have a relaxed, warm sound, suitable for acoustic jazz and classical chamber music. Of course, good equipment sounds good in all kinds of music... If I could get all of this for 400$ or less, that would be fantastic. That's asking for a lot, but I'm not in a hurry. I will wait for the right occasion.

So far, one amp that seems to meet all these criteria is the Phase Linear 4000. And I love its big, shiny look, especially the series 2. Luxman and Marantz seem to have great preamps, too. (I really like the champagne look!)

Any thoughts? What's your favorite vintage preamp? Anybody's familiar with the Phase Linear?

May I suggest two very nice, all discrete, preamps:
Yamaha C4
http://www.audio-heritage.jp/YAMAHA/amp/c-4.html
Kenwood L-07C
http://www.thevintageknob.org/KENWOOD/L07C/L07C.html

LIX

also, consider the Denon PRA-1000. i really enjoyed mine while i had it. it can often be found under $100 and has everything you're looking for except for selectable impedance. pretty handsome, too. and they have it in champagne or black.

My fab.... Model 7T Marantz....

Two outputs...Tone controls are rotor switch type that switch in & out caps and resistors... Flat is as flat as you will get....... As close to a Model 7C tube pre-amp as you will get .... Once recapped they really sing.... 400 to 500$.

johnk

lixaudio said:

May I suggest two very nice, all discrete, preamps:
Yamaha C4
http://www.audio-heritage.jp/YAMAHA/amp/c-4.html
Kenwood L-07C
http://www.thevintageknob.org/KENWOOD/L07C/L07C.html

LIX

Click to expand...

I can second the C-4, great under-appreciated pre.

Apt holman

It just works. Very neutral. Zillions were made in the 1980s. If you can get one cheap, it is worth updating.

PFC

HibouProfane said:

I'm thinking about bi-amping my set-up and I'm wondering about what would be a good preamp for this. Ideally, I'd need 2 sets of outputs, defeatable tone controls (or none at all), 2 phono inputs with one for moving coil, selectable impedance on the phono inputs (ok, that's a stretch). Tube-based preamps would most certainly be out of my financial reach, but I'd like it to have a relaxed, warm sound, suitable for acoustic jazz and classical chamber music. Of course, good equipment sounds good in all kinds of music... If I could get all of this for 400$ or less, that would be fantastic. That's asking for a lot, but I'm not in a hurry. I will wait for the right occasion.

So far, one amp that seems to meet all these criteria is the Phase Linear 4000. And I love its big, shiny look, especially the series 2. Luxman and Marantz seem to have great preamps, too. (I really like the champagne look!)

Any thoughts? What's your favorite vintage preamp? Anybody's familiar with the Phase Linear?

Click to expand...

Thank you everybody for your suggestions. Keep them coming, cause I'm not buying it in the short term, I just want to know what to look for when I'm ready. Japanese brands seem to be popular on the board! I'm looking on Ebay to have an idea of the prices. There is a non-powering up Yamaha C-4 going for a low price. I wonder how much it would cost to repair. There are at least 2 Carver C-4000 available. Any thoughts on that one? Other interesting models currently on the bay: Rotel RTC-850, Onkyo INTEGRA P-304 (looks real sweet), SAE 2100L, SAE 1M, MITSUBISHI DA-P20...

The Onkyo is the one that really caught my eye. The specs are impressive. 90 db signal-noise ratio on the MM phono section, and 80 db on the MC, 100 db on the line level ones...

Thanks again for your input. Very friendly crowd here!

I've been looking at vintage NAD preamps on eBay. Seem to have good construction and are generally unappreciated, from what I've heard anyway. They're really simple, generic, yet elegant looking, which is a quality I like. Couldn't tell you about the quality of sound though....

FWIW, i heard that Onkyo preamps of that generation were nothing to write home about, unlike the corresponding amps. not sure how universal that opinion is, however.

These guys >(here)< have a Luxman 5C50 laboratory reference preamp with some minor cosmetic flaws for $330. I think you'd be very hard pressed to find a better preamp.

I'll only comment on preamps that I have had extended experience with. If you run accross one of these you'd have a very solid preamp worth keeping for years.

That Luxman 5C50 is a great preamp even though it's largely unknown. Very quiet and transparent. However, it would require the hard to find optional MC module to provide MC capability. Extremely well built and variable phono load controls on the front panel.

I recently picked up a Sony TA-2000F which is very versatile and is in the quiet but detailed camp. Also extremely well built unit with some variable phono loading settings on the rear panel. It is so flexible that "if you can't do it with the Sony, you probably don't need to."

The Abt Holman is a very solid pre with a very good phono section. I had one as a loaner for an extended period.

While I'd also recommend the more modern and MC capable Sumo Athena and B&K Pro10MC, they only have a single phono input. The link to the Luxman above indicates they sold an Athena recently and describes it a bit. On both the Sumo and B&K, the MM/MC switch is located inside the case and both have front panel active/passive settings. While both are very nice preamps, I do like the B&K better, though. It has an outboard power supply and variable phono impedance but by way of variable resistors inside the case.

SBEEZ said:

I've been looking at vintage NAD preamps on eBay. Seem to have good construction and are generally unappreciated, from what I've heard anyway. They're really simple, generic, yet elegant looking, which is a quality I like. Couldn't tell you about the quality of sound though....

Click to expand...

Most of the NAD preamps are VERY nice sounding, with more than decent phono stages. They get even better with a little upgrade here and there!

Yamaha C2 is a great preamp with MM capability and stupid good build quality. Just a preamp weighs over 20 lbs with a thick machined aluminum case. I had one and stupidly sold it which I regret immensely.

Adcom GFP-565: dead quiet, very neutral, solidly built, with a damn good MM phono section to boot.

BTW, thanks to the people who recommended Audioproz. I didn't know them, but now they're bookmarked for good.

Yamaha C-4

lixaudio said:

May I suggest two very nice, all discrete, preamps:
Yamaha C4
http://www.audio-heritage.jp/YAMAHA/amp/c-4.html
Kenwood L-07C
http://www.thevintageknob.org/KENWOOD/L07C/L07C.html

LIX

Click to expand...

brutal said:

I can second the C-4, great under-appreciated pre.

Click to expand...

Me too :yes:

I think Sony TAE-8450 (nice PPM) or TAE-88's also fit the bill. I love the look and sound of both of them. Also they are extremely flexible , tons of inputs outputs.

Carver C-1. Two sets of outputs, MM & MC variable impedence phono inputs. Pass thru design with tone controls off, sonic holography, and less than $200. You can have it serviced by Rolland at High Tech Audio and he will replace any parts that need it with original Carver parts and replace all caps and you'd still have less than $400 invested.