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Record Cleaning with Tergitol

Cosmos

Cosmos

Speakerholic
Subscriber
Ok, it only stands to reason, a clean record is a quieter record. Pure Vinyl is good... The question as long as I can remember, when it comes to vinyl, expecially 40 year old vinyl with unknown history is how to get it clean and keep it there.

Back in the 70's. I used Parastat, Discwasher, Vac-O-Rec and many other methods to clean records. I still like a Vac-O-Rec and Zerostat for nice clean records. But when I find some vintage vinyl at a garage sale or thrift, the thing I want to do, before my styli hits it, is get it CLEAN! I have passed on dusty looking records without scratches, that I would have loved to had if they just weren't so dirty.

OK, I have for years used tap water and dish soap to "deep clean" records, but it was always obvious that it left a residue. A residue that one could see..

Looking for a better solution (literally and figuratively), I read a a post by drknstrmyknight (Frank) where he suggested Tergitol. Frank is semi-local, so I thought I'd contact him and see what he knew..

He suggested the following:

"The Canadian Conservation Institute (CCI) recommends the use of nonionic, ethelyne oxide condensates surfactants to clean sound recordings. The CCI does not foresee long-term problems associated with the use of nonionic surfactants such as Tergitol. Tergitol 15-S-3 is an oil soluble surfactant and 15-S-9 is a water soluble surfactant. Combined they remove a wide range of dirt and greases and can safely be used on sound recordings. Use 0.25 part of Tergitol 15-S-3 and 0.25 parts of Tergitol 15-S-9 per 100 parts of distilled water. (These products are available in small quantities from TALAS (Division of Technical Library Service Inc) 213 West 35th Street, New York, N.Y. (212) 465-8722.) The recording must then be rinsed thoroughly with distilled water to eliminate any trace of detergent residue."

He then went a step farther and offered to give me some Tergitol 15-S-3 & 15-S-9. Thanks Frank!

So, it's time for me to help spread the word..:

I picked out a very dirty, but scratch free Areosmith "Get Your Wings".. While it may not be an "audiophile" album, it fit the profile for a Guinea Pig as it was absolutely unusable as it was..

I mixed in 10 ml of each Tergitol product into a gallon of Distilled water.. (total cost 83 cents) miture rate 400:1:1 and bought a few extra gallons of distilled water... I used an oral syringe purchased from Walgreens to measure the 10 ml accurately. It is reported to be VERY important to get the ratio correct. using more Tergitol is said to be a very bad thing as it can leave a residue in the wrong ratio.

I then put the mix in a spray bottle and sprayed the mix onto "Aerosmith GYW". spread it around with the brush from a Parastat and let it sit a minute or so before rinsing with the Distilled water... Guess what.. Shiny vinyl with no apparent residue film and very low surface noise.

This is the best cleaner mixture I have ever tried...

Now on to making a automatic Disc Washer with a Ice Cream Maker motor..

Thanks again Frank.
 
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michaelhigh said:
Surely you jest about the ice cream motor...
Click to expand...

Surely he doesn't :D

Ice cream motors have long been recognized here as having the requisite torque to turn a disc under vacuum. Turntable motors just aren't that beefy, nor should they be.

I've used one in my homebrew RCM for years and it works like a champ.
 
michaelhigh said:
Surely you jest about the ice cream motor...
Click to expand...

No, actually I am completely serious. The ice cream maker motor has great torque and slow speed.

My intent is to create something that sprays and scrubs both sides at once then vacuums both sides dry at once. I may go with two chambers, a wet one and a dry one and a reversible two record spindle to have a record wet while one is drying.. The only real issue I see is the need to have a rinse cycle following the wash cycle. The keeper on the spindle will also keep the label dry with an o-ring seal and the shaft will be driven by a gear on the end of the shaft..
 
No, actually I am completely serious. The ice cream maker motor has great torque and slow speed.
Click to expand...

Quite true, also found in the kitchen is another stout performer the bread maker.
 
Well, I finally got a modified crevice tool and a shop vac with a turntable setup.. still working on a Ice Cream motor driven option..

What I am just blown away by, is how well the Turgitol combination cleans dirty records and the low noise floor after cleaning. I never remember records sounding this quiet, even new and what I thought was clean. This stuff is incredible. Thanks again Frank (drknstrmyknight) !
 
Nope

michaelhigh said:
Surely you jest about the ice cream motor...
Click to expand...
I know this post is a couple of months old, but here's photos of my RCM based on and ice cream churn motor and a VPI 16.5 wand:

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?p=3960156#post3960156

I use another industrial cleaning agent, VWR Scientific's Labtone. I ran across this article which led to me trying it. It's very effective, leaves no residue (when mixed a the correct strength) and has no agents that will harm 78's. I use it for vinyl also:

http://home.earthlink.net/~gnordenstam/RecordCollection/Cleaning.htm
 
Tergitol Link

pmsummer said:
A Tergitol source: http://apps.webcreate.com/ecom/catalog/product_specific.cfm?ClientID=15&ProductID=17376
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Thanks for the link. I notice in their description they state: "This product has proved effective in removing grease, oil and fingerprints from phonograph records and cleans old acetate, lacquer-covered, aluminum disks."

They also state: "This product is a mixture of linear secondary alcohols reacted with ethylene oxide."

Who's a chemist? I've read in the past that using a cleaner with alcohol on shellac (78 records) is a no no. I guess this excludes its use on 78s. True?
 
Re: Shellac: I can't imagine a formula cleaning BOTH vinyl and shellac with the same results other than H2O. I'm no Chemist but the idea doesn't sit well for me. The quoted statement did not claim to clean 78's. If it could, the company would shout it from the rooftops.

The product sounds like it has promise. I'd be interested in seeing some results of somekind. Before and after images/sound; and then again some 6mths later. Software spectrums and such.

I'm glad to hear a rinse process recommended. No matter what the cleaning fluid I feel content after a good vacuum rinse, air dry and a play/brush/stylus clean before it's new inner sleeping bag. Comfy vinyl is happy vinyl.

I'll get that popcorn
 
bhundu said:
The quoted statement did not claim to clean 78's.

I'll get that popcorn
Click to expand...
Agreed. It mentioned acetate and lacquer on aluminum, which I found interesting, since I thought lacquer would be alcohol soluble.

I mentioned it more as a warning. I've seen other mentions of Tergitol for record cleaning. I might spring for the $20 to get some and try it on my LP's.

Kettle corn would be nice. I love the stuff.
 
This sounds interesting and anything that removes more and does it better is worth investigating. To go back to original post however, I see no cleaner residue left from using an H20/Dawn/IsoAlcohol mixture. I believe H20 rinse after washing with this mixture removes all cleaner residue from the vinyl surface.
 
I've used the mixture described above and found the rinse needed to be repeated. Any RCM that uses a velvet type gasket will require that the gasket be changed between the wash/rinse cycles, and again between the rinse/rinse cycles.

I've since began using a 20% solution of wood alcohol in water and found it to be equally effective on vinyl, requiring only a single rinse in the worst cases, and sometimes none at all to remove the surfactant.

My jury is still out as to which is least damaging overall to the vinyl (all cleaning methods damage it somehow) but whichever is used the record should still be rinsed to remove what remains after the first pass.
 
:D Wow, Cures what ails ya, and cleans your records. Geritol.
My grandmother swore by the stuff. :D

Im gonna check it out for sure. I just couldnt resist.


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