Carver Silver Seven TUBE Amps on ebay

[bowtie427ss]

Still it would look and sound great in my lounge.......................

also makes an impressive space heater for those cool evenings. I know how much a 300wpc class A solid state amp warms my listening room, even my citation v with just a quad of 6L6GC's raise it a few degrees in an hour, i cannot imagine the BTU output of thirty 6550's or KT88's in the same room.

 

[Sam Cogley]

also makes an impressive space heater for those cool evenings. I know how much a 300wpc class A solid state amp warms my listening room, even my citation v with just a quad of 6L6GC's raise it a few degrees in an hour, i cannot imagine the BTU output of thirty 6550's or KT88's in the same room.

Bob Carver should have included a "food warmer" attachment that would fit above the tubes like a tube cage.

 

[a_retent]

Shuurre are nice... wouldn't turn 'em down if someone gave them to me, hell I'd even cough a couple grand for them. To say they're not worth crap is a subjective opinion, :nono: unless you've had experience with this particular model. I can say that I had a Carver DTL-100 CD player and it was the biggest piece of crap I ever owned, nothing but problems, but the rest of my Carver gear performed very well. This PARTICULAR model Carver amp (4 units=stereo pair) was given pretty high remarks by industry professionals. I was told that most of the first units were built by hand, all point to point connections soldered with Van den Hul silver solder. Somewhere in my mountain of crap I think I have copies of the press release and first brochure, maybe I'll dig around later.

I see the price has now exceeded the MSRP ($17,500.00) set back in 1987 and still hasn't cleared reserve. I used to sell Carver back then and could of bought these new for around 7-8k. BTW no further discussion is needed concerning the that whole rate of inflation/devalued dollar thang. Unless the entire amps spent the last 23 years in a vacuum (tubes/vacuum, I get it ) they are still used.

 

[TNRabbit]

From the owner over at carveraudio.com:

"Evidently, there seems to be some concern about the fact I was running the tube amps with no load (no speakers connected)
In fact, this IS a concern for the majority of tube amps. However, none of the Carver tube amps are affected by this.
The majority of tube amps WILL go into oscillation if there is no load placed on them. The Silver tube amps will NOT.
The circuit Bob designed is so stable, you can run these amps with an input signal... no load, and they will just sit there and purr away.
Where the majority of tube amps will start popping tubes like they are cheap light bulbs.

The other question I got was, Why is the right meter reading 0, as where the left bias meter is reading .2
The answer is, I took some of the photos before the output relay engaged on the right amp. The meters stay at 0 for about 4-5 minutes while the tubes are warming up.
The left amp was turned on before the right amp was. I saw a spot that needed dusting, and wound up turning on the right amp a few minutes later than the left.
Yes both meters work perfectly, and both read the same bias, around .2

I'll ask Bob to write up a little something on the circuitry and stability of the Silver amps, and post it here later."

 

[kevzep]

From the owner over at carveraudio.com:

"Evidently, there seems to be some concern about the fact I was running the tube amps with no load (no speakers connected)
In fact, this IS a concern for the majority of tube amps. However, none of the Carver tube amps are affected by this.
The majority of tube amps WILL go into oscillation if there is no load placed on them. The Silver tube amps will NOT.
The circuit Bob designed is so stable, you can run these amps with an input signal... no load, and they will just sit there and purr away.
Where the majority of tube amps will start popping tubes like they are cheap light bulbs.

The other question I got was, Why is the right meter reading 0, as where the left bias meter is reading .2
The answer is, I took some of the photos before the output relay engaged on the right amp. The meters stay at 0 for about 4-5 minutes while the tubes are warming up.
The left amp was turned on before the right amp was. I saw a spot that needed dusting, and wound up turning on the right amp a few minutes later than the left.
Yes both meters work perfectly, and both read the same bias, around .2

I'll ask Bob to write up a little something on the circuitry and stability of the Silver amps, and post it here later."

That would be cool, I am very interested in these amps, purely from a technical point of view, I could never afford them.
But hey looking forward to that post.
Thanks very much.

 

[bigmacc]

OK OK l admit it l am an ignorant smart=ass.

Impressive amps but l have a cheap solution. I believe Bob Carver claimed he could replicate the sound of any amp. Well instead of spending $20,000 or whatever while not find someone to create tube amps that sound like the Carver 7's for somewhat less $1,000 should do it.:thmbsp:

 

[kevzep]

OK OK l admit it l am an ignorant smart=ass.

Impressive amps but l have a cheap solution. I believe Bob Carver claimed he could replicate the sound of any amp. Well instead of spending $20,000 or whatever while not find someone to create tube amps that sound like the Carver 7's for somewhat less $1,000 should do it.:thmbsp:

Actually thats quite funny, give em a taste you reckon....................but who??? Damn I thought we were onto something there.
Oh well never mind.
I'm good looking at the pictures..................

 

[TNRabbit]

The whole point of the Silver Sevens was to thumb his nose at those who crapped on the Carver Challenge....

 

[Snow]

From the owner over at carveraudio.com:

"Evidently, there seems to be some concern about the fact I was running the tube amps with no load (no speakers connected)
In fact, this IS a concern for the majority of tube amps. However, none of the Carver tube amps are affected by this.
The majority of tube amps WILL go into oscillation if there is no load placed on them. The Silver tube amps will NOT.
The circuit Bob designed is so stable, you can run these amps with an input signal... no load, and they will just sit there and purr away.
Where the majority of tube amps will start popping tubes like they are cheap light bulbs.

The other question I got was, Why is the right meter reading 0, as where the left bias meter is reading .2
The answer is, I took some of the photos before the output relay engaged on the right amp. The meters stay at 0 for about 4-5 minutes while the tubes are warming up.
The left amp was turned on before the right amp was. I saw a spot that needed dusting, and wound up turning on the right amp a few minutes later than the left.
Yes both meters work perfectly, and both read the same bias, around .2

I'll ask Bob to write up a little something on the circuitry and stability of the Silver amps, and post it here later."

Coming from your buddy James you know it has to be true :lmao: But it does seem to make sense that what he said is correct. I would tell him to have you or someone to ask a question regarding these issues on ask a question on Ebay and have him give the answer there to avoid any speculation from potential buyers.

REGARDS JIM

 

[rroobbcc]

The whole point of the Silver Sevens was to thumb his nose at those who crapped on the Carver Challenge....

Exactly! The way I remember it is that after Bob won the "Carver Challenge", others in the industry attacked him along the lines of "well you can make you amps mimick the great sound engineered by others, but you can't engineer great sound into your own designs". The Silver Sevens were Bob's response to those attacks. He then went on to create the M4.0t, Silver 7t and Silver 9t which were designed to sound like the Silver Sevens (similiar to how the M1.5t was designed to sound like a Mark Levinson and the M1.0t like a Conrad Johnson - IIRC anyway).

So in theory the cheapest way to get the Silver Sevens' sound characteristics is to pickup a M4.0t. However, something tells me that it just wouldn't be quite the same.

BTW, a year or so ago on a different forum, there was a thread where everyone posted their dream system. I selected the Carver Silver Sevens to power the main panels of a pair of Infinity IRS Betas. At the currently bid price, it is painfully obvious that that system will remain exactly that... only a dream.

Rob

 

[rroobbcc]

I just noticed it says "cash only for local pickup". Now seriously... who is going to stroll up to some strangers house to pick something up with >$20k in their pocket???

 

[TNRabbit]

I just noticed it says "cash only for local pickup". Now seriously... who is going to stroll up to some strangers house to pick something up with >$20k in their pocket???

Someone with a GUN in the other pocket~ :thmbsp:

 

[Stereo_type]

Kevzep wrote:

Having no speakers connected to a tube amp is fine if there is no signal going through the amp, but as soon as the tubes start swinging voltage through the output transformer, they must be connected to a speaker or dummy load...

:scratch2: :sigh:

A humble advisory for anyone who owns an audio tube amp, other than a guitar amp, and isn't already familiar: It's actually not a good idea to have any no load condition on the output of most tube amps at any point, especially when powering up!
Why? The power-up cycle creates plenty of potential pulses that can cause arcing with _no_ signal present, when there is no load on the outputs' secondary (spkr connections). It could be (potentially) possible to do so without arcing damage for maybe a small handful of certain tube amps, but powering on with no load is not something that should be accepted as "fine".

It's not a good idea, unless the average tube-based guitar amp is included in this subject. That would be acceptable for most all tube-guitar amps. Why? Virtually all tube-guitar amps are engineered to "anticipate" this possible no-load condition, so the spkr out jack is essentially always the shorting type; unplug whatever given spkr and the output is shorted. :thmbsp: A dead short on the secondary is basically harmless, even _with_ signal swinging, at least for brief periods.

 

[TNRabbit]

From the owner over at carveraudio.com:

"Evidently, there seems to be some concern about the fact I was running the tube amps with no load (no speakers connected)
In fact, this IS a concern for the majority of tube amps. However, none of the Carver tube amps are affected by this.
The majority of tube amps WILL go into oscillation if there is no load placed on them. The Silver tube amps will NOT.
The circuit Bob designed is so stable, you can run these amps with an input signal... no load, and they will just sit there and purr away.
Where the majority of tube amps will start popping tubes like they are cheap light bulbs.

The other question I got was, Why is the right meter reading 0, as where the left bias meter is reading .2
The answer is, I took some of the photos before the output relay engaged on the right amp. The meters stay at 0 for about 4-5 minutes while the tubes are warming up.
The left amp was turned on before the right amp was. I saw a spot that needed dusting, and wound up turning on the right amp a few minutes later than the left.
Yes both meters work perfectly, and both read the same bias, around .2

I'll ask Bob to write up a little something on the circuitry and stability of the Silver amps, and post it here later."

Kevzep wrote:

:scratch2: :sigh:

A humble advisory for anyone who owns an audio tube amp, other than a guitar amp, and isn't already familiar: It's actually not a good idea to have any no load condition on the output of most tube amps at any point, especially when powering up!
Why? The power-up cycle creates plenty of potential pulses that can cause arcing with _no_ signal present, when there is no load on the outputs' secondary (spkr connections). It could be (potentially) possible to do so without arcing damage for maybe a small handful of certain tube amps, but powering on with no load is not something that should be accepted as "fine".

It's not a good idea, unless the average tube-based guitar amp is included in this subject. That would be acceptable for most all tube-guitar amps. Why? Virtually all tube-guitar amps are engineered to "anticipate" this possible no-load condition, so the spkr out jack is essentially always the shorting type; unplug whatever given spkr and the output is shorted. :thmbsp: A dead short on the secondary is basically harmless, even _with_ signal swinging, at least for brief periods.

Read previous post; this comes directly from Bob Carver--

 

[elcoholic]

Schwing! It's fitting that they are on an altar in the picture. I worked with a RF engineering director back in the early 90's that built a set of these. They cost him about $2k a piece he said. Most of the cost was in getting the custom torroidially wound transformers made.

 

[kevzep]

Kevzep wrote:

:scratch2: :sigh:

A humble advisory for anyone who owns an audio tube amp, other than a guitar amp, and isn't already familiar: It's actually not a good idea to have any no load condition on the output of most tube amps at any point, especially when powering up!
Why? The power-up cycle creates plenty of potential pulses that can cause arcing with _no_ signal present, when there is no load on the outputs' secondary (spkr connections). It could be (potentially) possible to do so without arcing damage for maybe a small handful of certain tube amps, but powering on with no load is not something that should be accepted as "fine".

It's not a good idea, unless the average tube-based guitar amp is included in this subject. That would be acceptable for most all tube-guitar amps. Why? Virtually all tube-guitar amps are engineered to "anticipate" this possible no-load condition, so the spkr out jack is essentially always the shorting type; unplug whatever given spkr and the output is shorted. :thmbsp: A dead short on the secondary is basically harmless, even _with_ signal swinging, at least for brief periods.

With respect, I wouldnt necessarally say "other than a guitar amp", I know my two Marshalls JCM800 and JMP Super Lead 100 do NOT have shorting speaker jacks, so I flicked through my guitar amp schematic book quickly and have found very few guitar amps have shorting speaker jacks on them, I also know this from servicing guitar amps for two large backline hire companies.
Some Fender reissues have them, strangely enough in their combos, which have speakers connected all the time, but not Marshall, not old Fenders except the Super Twin (180watt from 6 x 6L6), Hiwatt, Ampeg, Mesa Boogie, but some Vox amps have them...............My point is to say always have a load on a tube amp when powered up or powering up..........good point about the powering up scernario, it makes sense when you think about it. Its all too easy to fry something in a tube amp, easier than what you might think.

 

[Stereo_type]

Kevzep wrote in #27:

Having no speakers connected to a tube amp is fine if there is no signal going through the amp...

:tears:

Then kevzep wrote in #56

...My point is to say always have a load on a tube amp when powered up or powering up...good point about the powering up scernario, it makes sense when you think about it. Its all too easy to fry something in a tube amp, easier than what you might think...

:sigh: :scratch2:

Kev, you seem to have written two opposite things there, unless that first one was a mistake, OK?:yes:

TNRabbit said, "Read previous post..." that included this:

The majority of tube amps WILL go into oscillation if there is no load placed on them. The Silver tube amps will NOT...

:scratch2:

Me? I'm not really sure what to make of these responses, except that what I wrote as a humble advisory agrees 100% with,

...The majority of tube amps will go into oscillation...

right? :sigh:

Yes, it's true; the Carver Silver was not intended as part of my humble advisory, as it is far from the average tube amp, so I thought that was sort of a given that would be understood here, right? :scratch2:

Regarding guitar tube amps with shorting output jacks: I have yet to see/use/repair a Fender tube amp of any model that doesn't have a shorting jack; that is, if there's a spkr out jack on the back of the chassis; at least that's the norm here in the US, and that goes for the schematics, too. However, I'll probably consider the possibility that this element might not always be included in a given schematic, although most Fender schematics I see, do in fact show these anyway.

The reason Kev says he doesn't see shorting jacks on certain Marshalls is true and simple enough, in that they compensate for this by including a resistor load, so a load is always present; spkrs or no spkrs. My advisory refers to the majority of tube amps; (90% or more) with no built-in load present. Back to guitar tube amps: name most any US tube model Fender, and if you have a spkr output jack on the back, you'll have the shorting jack; yep, that's a fact, "jack".:thmbsp:

 

[kevzep]

I did write two different things, I have never experienced a tube amp going into oscillation, or arcing the output transformer or any other part, with the amp powered up and no speaker plugged in, this is why I said,

"Having no speakers connected to a tube amp is fine if there is no signal going through the amp... "

However it was pointed out there are risks doing that, which seemed plausable to me so accepted that and later in my other post I said,

"...My point is to say always have a load on a tube amp when powered up or powering up...good point about the powering up scernario, it makes sense when you think about it. Its all too easy to fry something in a tube amp, easier than what you might think.."

That way in any event, always having a load on an output of a tube amp is the safest way to go, it doesnt mean that I no longer believe my first post however. But for me NOW I will always have a load on a tube amp as an extra precaution after reading this thread.

BUT, it is always good to hear other peoples experiences and knowledge. However, I never "called you out" on your humble advisory, I based my inoformation on my real experiences with amps, which includes guitar amps not hifi amps, and your humble advisory.

I said some Fender re-issues have, and some of the older Fenders also have them, but they are combos with a speaker plugged in all the time anyway.
Many old fenders dont, and I say that because that is what I have seen, and I confirmed it in the schematics.
Both my marshalls one from 1982 and one from 1975 have none as I said before, and I cant find any load resistor on the shematics or in my amplifers.
So maybe thats a USA thing, theres a reason to be careful.
I work on many Mesa Boogies, and the same, no shorting Jacks............
What does all this mean?
Be careful!! Some do and some dont there can be no disputing that....... You may get a nasty surprise..........Personally I dont want to mis-inform people and have someone ruin their amp on my behalf.
I could have made an official note refering to my revised comment to save confusion.
This thread is way off topic now sorry to those who are following the Carver story.
I would always have speakers plugged into the Carver too, why wouldnt you? If I had one it would be on all the time, because I would be using it all the time.........

 

[TNRabbit]

17 bids; at $19,400.00 as of 11 a.m. EDT--and still 4 days left on the auction!

I predict they'll reach the upper 20s, possibly break $30k.

 

[TNRabbit]

11 hours left; today, we'll see what separates the men from the boys~